GE 226: How to Be a Billionaire: Naveen Jain On Taking Moon Shots and Having Audacious Goals (podcast) With Naveen Jain

Naveen Jain

Hey everyone! In today’s episode, I share the mic with Naveen Jain, founder of Moon Express and Viome.

Tune in to hear Naveen share how he is leveraging technology today to address some of the world’s largest problems, why he believes it’s imperative for entrepreneurs to be intellectually curious, and how creating an impact on society rather than focusing on making money is what sets billionaires apart from millionaires.

Download podcast transcript [PDF] here: How to Be a Billionaire: Naveen Jain On Taking Moon Shots and Having Audacious Goals TRANSCRIPT

Time-Stamped Show Notes:

  • 00:36 – Leave a review and rating and subscribe to the Growth Everywhere Podcast
  • 00:57 – Eric welcomes Naveen Jain
  • 01:27 – Insights into Naveen’s entrepreneurial journey
    • 01:31 – As an entrepreneur, his focus is on solving the biggest problems facing humanity
    • 02:43 – Started Moon Express 7 years back
    • 03:43 – Cost United States 25 billion dollars to land on the moon the first time; set off on his entrepreneurial journey by aiming to bring this number down to $100 million
    • 04:21 – Expects costs to be less than $10 million when they land on the moon later this year
    • 04:55 – Believes that the next 10 years will be the most disruptive 10 years in history
    • 05:28 – When they land on the moon, their small group will be the fourth superpower ever to land on the moon
  • 06:22 – Commercial benefits of landing on the moon are huge; the moon is a huge reserve for Helium Three, an excellent source of clean energy
    • 07:25 – Advantageous to become a multi-planetary society in order to negate the possibility of extinction
    • 07:30 – Moon has abundant water resources, the fuel for humanity
  • 08:48 – Once you become an expert, you start to think like an incremental expert
  • 09:15 – Knowing nothing about healthcare enabled Naveen to have a fresh and original view of the problems plaguing the system
    • 09:37 – Goal at Viome: create a world where sickness is optional
    • 10:37 – The healthcare system today is more about the survival of the fittest
    • 12:24 – Only 1% of our genes come from our DNA; 99% comes from the organisms living inside of our gut
    • 13:20 – Our immune system does not know what to do; it’s trained by this gut bacteria
    • 14:42 – Setting an audacious goal for Viome enabled Naveen to have the best people in the industry come on board
    • 15:49 – The best people joined Naveen to help him realize his “moonshot” of improving healthcare and helping billions of people around the world
    • 16:49 – Listening to TED Talks and attending Singularity University helped Naveen kick off Viome
    • 17:27 – Read six to seven books on one topic to get different opinions about what is going on
    • 18:20 – Figured out that the best way to penetrate the market with innovative products was to enter the system on the edges and empower the customer with information
  • 19:29 – Large companies are faced with an innovative dilemma; the system does not allow them to be innovative
  • 20:57 – Today, everyone has a platform to attract top talent
  • 22:48 – Do not follow the habits of successful people, but follow your own thought processes
    • 23:09 – Respect the other person’s time
  • 24:08 – Can solve the largest problems by applying the technology of today
    • 25:05 – Creating beef from stem cells which will negate the need for raising cattle to meet our beef requirement
    • 25:37 – If you care for the environment, stop eating meat; this will do more for the environment than driving a Tesla!
  • 26:03 – What is the one big struggle that you faced while growing your business? – Difficult to find funding for Moon Express in its initial years
  • 27:23 – Parenting is counter-intuitive; like starting a company, you have to constantly rethink how things are being done
    • 28:20 – Naveen’s daughter developed a passion for neuroscience after going to Singularity University
    • 28:43 – His oldest son started Kairos Society; his youngest son is a junior at Stanford
    • 29:41 – Advice to his children regarding success: “Your self-worth is not what you own but what you create”
    • 30:24 – Love for his children is unconditional, but approval is not
  • 31:38 – Imperative for an entrepreneur to be intellectually curious
  • 32:57 – What’s one must-read book do you recommend? The Disease Delusion: Conquering the Causes of Chronic Illness for a Healthier, Longer, and Happier Life, The Human Superorganism: How the Microbiome Is Revolutionizing the Pursuit of a Healthy Life, The Brain That Changes Itself: Stories of Personal Triumph from the Frontiers of Brain Science, The Epigenetics Revolution, Abundance: The Future Is Better Than You Think, How Will You Measure Your Life?
  • 34:26 – What sets billionaires apart from millionaires is their focus on BIG problems rather than making money
  • 34:58 – What is one new tool that you have added in the last one year that you have really enjoyed, like Evernote? – Creating a specific newsfeed on Twitter allows him to focus on a subject of interest
  • 35:34 – Connect with Naveen via Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn or e-mail
  • 35:51 – Head back to Growth Everywhere for show notes and additional resources; leave a review and rating and subscribe to the Growth Everywhere Podcast

3 Key Points:

  1. Venturing into a new domain allows you to get a fresh perspective on how to tackle problems.
  2. Having your “moonshot” (an audacious goal that solves some of the biggest problems for the greater good of the society) is how you can attract and retain some of the best talent in any industry.
  3. Billionaires concentrate on the BIG problems rather than making money; money is just a byproduct of solving those problems.

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Full Transcript of The Episode

Show transcript
Naveen Jain: Number one, obviously, if you think about the biggest goal, the biggest problem facing humanity is a possible extinction, right? So going to the moon has two purposes. One is obviously commercial. The moon has 16 quadrillion worth of minerals on the moon, whether you're looking at a rare Earth element, you're looking at the platinum-grade materials, or you're looking at helium three. And helium three as you know is probably the most advanced and the best clean energy source for fusion energy. So that means a small quantity of helium three could power the planet Earth for generations to come.
And the second goal is much more noble cause, that we all live in a single spacecraft called planet Earth. And it's only a matter of time when we get hit by a large asteroid. And if that were to happen, we will all become asteroid. I'm sorry, we all become dinosaurs, right? And the idea really is if you think about it right, if you could hear the dinosaurs rolling in their graves, what would they be saying? They wish they had one good entrepreneur dinosaur that has to be alive, roaming on the Mars and roaming on the moon, and roaming on other planets. So to a large extent, it is for ourselves that we become a multi-planetary society.
The other advantage of being on the moon is, the moon has water. And water really is the oil for the space economy. It's component of hydrogen and oxygen make rocket fuel, and they also make a fuel for humanity. So even if you were to settle down on the Mars, the best way to learn to live away from this planet, to be close by in our sister planet, on the moon, and because once we learn to live on the moon, the problems are very similar, and we can live on the Mars. You and I rather be lunatic, living in the moon three days away, than to live on the Mars and be a Martian six month away, right?

Eric Sue: What's interesting you know, you have the success that you want. You're able to take these, let's just call them moon shots, right? You know, going to the moon, and we can talk about some of the other technologies that you're working on right now. But people are probably thinking, well, it's easy for Naveen to say. He's successful, right. So people are probably wondering, how do you build up success to the point where you're able to take moon shots like you are right now?

Naveen Jain: The interesting thing is, today the cost of these moon shots are so small and in fact I can tell you that my other company that I started a company called Viome. And that probably is a great example. But as you can imagine, I've started now six companies, and never being the two companies have never been in the same industry. And the reason for that is, once you're an expert in any field, you actually start to think like an incremental expert, right? You can improve it by 10% or 15%, but you can never ever disrupt that industry by 10 times or 100 times. So whether I did the things the smartphones in late nineties, before there were any smartphones, because we knew that will come, and we could disrupt the market.
In space, and now the healthcare, the Viome is the healthcare company. What do I know about healthcare? Until I started this company, I knew nothing about healthcare, and that was the biggest advantage I had. That means I wasn't thinking like them. I wasn't thinking like the people in the system. And I was able to completely revisit why the system exists and what the problems are. And completely bypass the system. And our goal at Viome, the moon shot here is, what if we can create a world where sickness is optional? So think about that. Can we actually create the technology that allows us to look deep inside our body, understand how it works, and keep it from being sick? And the good thing is, now we have technology at our disposal. And that is the power of technology. That if we think, we can do it. If we can imagine it, we can do it. And the only thing that stops us from doing things is either because we are afraid to fail, or we just can't imagine what is possible.

Eric Sue: Obviously, the first person that comes to mind when I think about these things, you have Elon Musk, not knowing anything about rocket science, right? And then going out and then, boom Spacex, right? So how do you become an expert in these fields? Like Viome, what's a good example, how did you go about learning?

Naveen Jain: It's very interesting. When I decided that I'm gonna go out and take on the healthcare system because to me, the healthcare system is really an example of what happens when a system that starts out with a particular noble goal of taking care of people who are sick. Over time, it actually, the system becomes so large, that it becomes an organism in itself, and the Darwinian theory starts to take hold. The survival of the system becomes the only goal, and it forgets the purpose that it's designed for. So today's healthcare system, the patient is no longer the stakeholder, it's only the insurance company and the doctors and hospitals and the unions and the regulators become, really, the stakeholder that are deciding what to do with a patient, who seem to be the burden on the system, right?
And it was designed for a time when we were falling sick, or we were actually dying from infection. So it was designed for episodic times when we had infection or acute diseases, and we went to the hospital and we got the medicine and life was good. And today we live in a time where we have these chronic diseases. And these chronic diseases are you obviously sick all the time. A system that was designed for episodic thing, now is actually is a constantly being sick, it's actually chronic.
Now here is the irony. The irony is the cure for the infectious diseases is what caused these chronic diseases. And our whole hypothesis was so wrong. We believed that if we can somehow keep the humans free of all the bacteria and viruses, we will have the healthy human being. And we didn't realize that nature created human beings as a symbiotic ecosystem. In fact, most people may not realize, just like I didn't until I started Viome, that only 1% of our genes are expressed, the genes expressed in our body come from our own DNA. 99% of the genes that are expressed in our body actually come from the organisms that live inside our gut. So think about that. The massive organ that's providing three million genes compared to our 20,000 genes from our DNA, we have completely ignored that. And when we start to take antibiotics, or we're taking the processed food or the other toxins in our body, we're killing these microorganisms. And these are the ones that actually provide the nutrients and the energy that our body needs. So when you start to kill them, no wonder people have the Alzheimer diseases, the autoimmune diseases, obesity, and the diabetes, and the cancer. All of these are the disease of inflammation. And inflammation happens because our immune system doesn't know what to do. And our immune system is actually trained by these gut bacteria.
So you can start to see now what is happening that as we are eating poorly, and as we are killing our ecosystem inside our gut, we are becoming constantly sick. And that realization, Eric, is what got me to start Viome. And we say what if we can actually find what is happening inside the body at a molecular level? At a molecular level, I mean understanding every single living organism that's in your gut, whether it's the bacteria, whether it's a virus. Whether it's a fungus, whether it's a yeast. And all these things are, on the surface, sound like the bad thing. They are actually are symbiotic with us. That means when we eat fiber, our body can't digest fiber, it goes to a large intestine, and these microbes eat the fiber, in turn, they release the short-chain fatty acids, which is what our body needs. They produce the vitamins, they produce and actually take the energy out of the food and give it to us. So to a large extent, that relationship was broken.
Now let me give you another example. When we started with a simple goal, I knew nothing about this field. I sent out this moon shot. I'm going to create a world where sickness is optional. And by having such an audacious goal, I started to get some of the best people around the world contacting me and say they want to be part of it. So for example, the head of the Watson Research contacted me and say he wants to join and quit IBM and all the artificial intelligence work he's doing, he wants to apply to the problem that I set out to do because he said that is his calling. Dr. Messier, who was working with Craig Venter who actually obviously is you know, the complete human genome sequencing, working at human longevity. When she heard about the problem I was trying to solve, she quit her job and joined us. I got the technology at Los Alamos National Lab. They were developing it for national security. And the person who was developing it, Momo, came and said, I wanna solve this problem. I don't wanna cushy, government job anymore, I wanna solve this audacious problem.
So think about what happened. If I was solving building a small iPhone app, there's no way these world-class people would have joined and say, hey I wanna build an iPhone app too. Right? They joined me because I had this moon shot of a big idea that what if we could do and help billions of people around the world? And solve a problem that cost as humanity trillions of dollars to our system, and by the way suffering of billions of people constantly. Whether it is cancer, or whether it is diabetes or obesity or autoimmune diseases, we are constantly suffering. So what if we can remove all of that? And that is the goal we set out to do.

Eric Sue: Got it, okay. And then just your learning process for like, you know ... you're doing Moon Express, right? That's been around you said seven years or so, right?

Naveen Jain: Yeah.

Eric Sue: And then Viome is the latest one, right? So what was that process like, when you started ... I'm just trying to get the kind of what did you do, exactly how would Naveen do it? When you started Viome how did you go about learning what you needed to learn? Did you just Google it? Or did you go to the library? How did you learn all this stuff?

Naveen Jain: It's very interesting actually, I'm glad you asked, Eric. Because that is something, when you start, if you have just enough of the vocabulary, which I got by listening to TED talks and by attending Singularity University. And by attending Singularity University I knew there was something called genetics, I knew there was something called epigenetics, and I knew how kind of in the biology they work. But that's all I knew, and when I started looking at the healthcare thing, I started to see that microbiome is really the key. So I did two things, number one is I started buying at least six or seven books from Amazon that all were related to microbiome. And the reason for that is, I don't want to be caught up because one person's, or what one person's opinion. So I always like to read six, seven, eight books because then you get different people's opinion of what is going on.
And then what I do is I always go to the Twitter, and I started to customize my feed just only to the science articles and research that's coming out in this field. And every day when I wake up at 4:30 in the morning, I spend the first two hours looking at all the research that is around the microbiome and genetics. And that allows me to see where the field is going. So by looking at the research articles, which tend to be about 15 years ahead of anything that is gonna be there in the, what I would say in the clinical [inaudible 00:18:06], it allows me to now build the company at the cutting edge because I'm taking the stuff that is in the research lab, and bringing it to the people directly, rather than going through the system. If you go through the system, it will take 15 years.
And as opposed to going and partnering with the doctors and the hospitals and the insurance companies, I decided the best way that innovative ideas get to the market is by coming outside the system, on the edges. And go directly to the consumer, and empower them with the knowledge and information and actual recommendations so they know exactly what to do. So by doing that, I am no longer get sucked into the system.
So if I go to the insurance company, or doctors or hospital, guess what happens? You as an outsider will come in, and the first thing the system does is swallows you, and the second thing it does is that all of the immune system of the system is gonna start attacking you so they can kill you. So this is really the antibodies attacking you, because they don't like anything coming from outside. And the only way that innovation happens is it comes from the edges.
So when you look at the personal computers, when they came out, they didn't go out and attack the miniframes or the mainframe, they came out of the word processor, became a spreadsheet with a better calculator, and they became more and more powerful, and the next thing you knew they were replacing everything else. [inaudible 00:19:29] innovators [inaudible 00:19:31] not that large companies don't know what to do, it is a system that does not allow them to be innovative.
So by going directly to the consumer, because they are really the people who care most about their own disease, and they become expert. And what we did is, by essentially bypassing the system, we are able to get tens of thousands of people directly working with us. And the more people were working with us, the more data we had for our artificial intelligence could make the system even better. And I think in a very short period of time, we now have the artificial intelligence that is smarter than any human being can ever be, because constantly learning from the latest research, and it's constantly applying the learning to every single data set. And every data set that we get, it actually makes it better. So it really gets an exponential impact as each person joins the system.

Eric Sue: I love it. You know what's interesting, as I look at all these companies that you're a part of, obviously recruiting's a big thing, right? You need to have smart engineers, you have to have smart scientists and everything. And what you just a talked about with Viome and Moon Express, is you know, these are moon shots right? And then you basically announce it to people and then a lot of people will come, smart people will come and join you, right? Because it's cool stuff to do. Now people are probably thinking, well you know, great. Naveen has a platform and everything, but how can I go about recruiting really smart talent? So how did you do it in the earlier days when you didn't have a platform?

Naveen Jain: Well, again, the good thing about that Eric, is that everyone has a platform. Because unlike in the olden days, only the rich people's voice were being heard when only we could get the information was through the radio or television. Today, we have the social media. Every one of us has a chance to create a viral video. Every one of us has chance to put something up on a social media, and essentially use our own small network to essentially blow it up. And if we are doing something that is so audacious, it will get picked up.
And that is the beauty of thing is, you no longer have to rely on a platform. You can create a platform. I mean think about it, someone talking to you has a platform. And the people, if they were doing something audacious, you will be more than happy to bring them on your platform and say, hey, tell me how this audacious idea of sustaining 20 billion people on Earth, how are you gonna increase the, create abundance of food? How do you plan to create the abundance of energy? How do you plan to create the abundance of fresh water? And somebody's solving that problem, wouldn't you be the first one to say, come on my platform and talk about it?

Eric Sue: Yeah, totally. I think some people are probably thinking, well, great Naveen has a following and all that. But I think if you're, honestly, if you're doing something interesting, and you're consistent about it, that following will build. So I think anybody can build it. So to your point, basically. Now, the other thing is I remember meeting you at Collision Conference, and we had a couple conversations, and then actually we had a phone conversation. I think before we had the phone conversation you said, call me. But here's the thing, you sent me an email ... you opened my email, and you sent me an email back at three a.m., right? And then when I called you, you picked up immediately. So my question is probably like, how the heck are you so efficient? What are your habits?

Naveen Jain: So again, I'm going to actually ... you know the question is actually the wrong question. You never want to follow the habits of the successful people. You wanna follow their thought process. For example, Tony Robbins takes the ice bath every morning. You can take the ice bath three times a day, it's never going to make you Tony Robbins. What's gonna make you Tony Robbins is to think like Tony Robbins, right? So let me give you the thought process of how I work. It's a respect for other person's time, that means you always wanna make sure that you're respectful; when you tell someone to do something, you say things you mean, and you do what you say.
And the second thing that I follow is, you know, I work long hours. And the reason I work long hours is because every minute of my life, I love it. I don't go watch movies, I don't watch news. To me, it's all distraction. I don't want to be watching a movie, being in someone's world. I enjoy my world, I love my world. I don't wanna change my world. The fact that I do work seven days a week, I do work 18-hour days. And the thing is, to large extent I also love, you know, like when I met you, I wanna take this message of hope and abundance, and I want every single person who's listening to this, is really be thinking, what is my moon shot? What would I do? Why can't I create abundance of fresh water? And the interesting thing is, every single thing, these large problems, you can solve them today because the technology exists today. It is just simply a matter of you applying any one of these exponential technologies to solve the problem.
For example, for agriculture, all you have to do is start thinking about what kind of sensors can you apply that will make agriculture better so you don't have to spend as much of fresh water? What if you can do aquaponic? What if you can do aeroponic? What if you can start to use sensors with small drones that can tell you when the crop is dry or when it needs some help, or when it is deceased? What if you can start to change the microbiome of the soil? Because at the end of the day, the plants are no different than human being. In fact, we as humans we share 90% of the same DNA with the plant. So what if you can adjust the microbiome of the soil so the yield of the plant will go up?
And you can go on and on and on, and start to think about and say, if I care about the environment, why can't I create a beef that comes out of the stem cell and create the biofactories so that now you can have as much beef as you want without ever having to raise the cattle? And if you don't have to raise the cattle, you don't need all ... 50% of agriculture used to feed the cattles. You don't need agriculture to feed the cattles because now you can use the agriculture to feed the people. You don't need as much water if you're not using as much agriculture.
So all these things are connected if you understand what is the root cause. And by the way, if you really care about the environment, you don't have to actually drive a Tesla. All you have to do is stop eating meat. And you will be doing more for the environment than you will ever do by driving a Tesla.

Eric Sue: I love it. Great. So one of the things we talked about before this was more about talking about how people can ... and you just mentioned it, you know how people can think about things with a more abundant perspective, right? But I still love stories because stories are good on this podcast, so what's one big struggle that you've faced while growing any of your businesses? Just tell us a good story.

Naveen Jain: Every business goes through the struggle and to me every struggle is an opportunity for you to go think about it differently, right? So whether you look at the Moon Express, you know it was very difficult in the early days for someone to say, I'm going to fund this moon shot. Because the first thing they ask you, is who has done it? How do you know it's even doable? How do you even know that the United States ever even landed on the moon, because it must have been just a simply a quick landing, right? And to me, this is where the inspiration comes from. So when I started early days, I simply go and tell people imagine in our lifetime, we watch ... always have a chance to watch the history being made. How often in our lifetime we actually get to become a part of making the history together? Come join me, let's make the history together. Or watch me do it, and you'll always regret that you had a chance to be part of it, but you were sitting outside watching it.

Eric Sue: Cool. Love it. One other thing I saw before we actually talked was super interesting. You spoke at a TED conference, but not only that, I've seen your kids also speak at TED conferences too. Can you speak about that?

Naveen Jain: Yes. I mean, to me the biggest accomplishment as parents we have is really our children. And to me, the parenting is so counterintuitive. It is no different than actually starting a company and re-thinking about how it could be done. A lot of the time we as parents want to do things for our children that they believe they have a passion for. And when the children are young, it is very difficult for them to have a passion about something they don't even know.
You know my daughter, when she was 16 year old, she came to me and said, dad, I know you love science and technology. I want nothing to do with science and technology, so just get used to it. I have a passion, I want to pursue it. As opposed to saying sweetie, go ahead and go do it, I would love to help you pursue your passion, I said sweetie, you gotta let the dad do his job. Dad's job is to expose you to the things you haven't been exposed to yet, before you find your passion. By my allowing you to pursue [inaudible 00:28:16] passion is really my saying to you, I don't care what you do because I don't have time for it. Instead, I allowed her to go to Singularity University to learn about neuroscience and technology. And that's how she developed the passion for something she didn't even know she had. And now she graduated from Stanford, Stanford Stanfellow, Stanford Mayfield Fellow. Board of the Stanford Women in Business. And now working at a neuroscience company essentially doing more of fair women empowerment.
Our oldest son started Cairo Society when he was 17 years old. And that's now world's largest college entrepreneurship society. And when he started it, it was simply about bringing the entrepreneurs together and when he had Bill Gates and Bill Clinton and everyone coming and joining. Guess what happened? Since he was doing it for helping others, now he became one of the most connected persons. So this last week he had a full profile in Wired magazine. He was featured in Wall Street Journal two weeks ago as essentially the power broker of Silicon Valley. Inc magazine wrote a cover article on him, "World's Most Connected 21-Year-Old." He started a company called Human. He sold the company and he's starting a second company.
And our youngest one is now a junior at Stanford. Right? So each kid's turned out to be one amazing kid. Because we actually separated and told them what success is about. So every single day, we will tell them that your self-worth is not from what you own, but it comes from what you create. So you may own a lot, but you're still useless and worthless to the society because you haven't created anything. Your success will never be measured by amount of money you have in the bank. It will always be measured by how much impact have you had on society? How many lives have you impacted positively? And only way you will ever know that you have become successful, is when you become humble, because humility is a sign of success. If you still have an iota of arrogance left in you, that means you're still trying to prove something to yourself, or someone else. You're not successful.
And the last thing is, we really separated the two things. I told our children that our love for you is always going to be unconditional, but our approval is not. That means you always will have to earn our respect and our approval. But you never will have to earn our love. We will love you, but that doesn't mean we're gonna approve of what you do until you follow the value system that we believe in. Which is go out and help as many people as you can, and doing good and doing well are not mutually exclusive. So never be afraid to create a company that solves a big problem, and make it very profitable, because profit is the engine that allows you to do a large good. Even if you are the richest man in the world, you can do a small good before you run out of money. So if you ever desire to help billion people, create a profitable company. If you want to help a hundred, create a non-profit.

Eric Sue: Love it. So selfishly, I know earlier you talked about ... we talked about habits a little earlier. But you know I always wonder, right? If you look at a Warren Buffet, he reads 5-plus hours a day, right? I mean, what are some key habits that you have? Because I always like looking at templates from people. And I rarely get billionaires on the show, anyway.

Naveen Jain: So I tell you that the number one thing is being intellectually curious. And that is something we always instill in our children. So as an entrepreneur, to me being intellectually curious is the number one thing you can do. The day you stop becoming intellectually curious you actually become dead. And in fact, you know most of us will say I can only take you to the water, I can't make you drink. What if your goal is not to take them the water? What if your goal is simply to make them thirsty? And if you make someone thirsty, they will find their own water, and they will drink. And so I focus on really, that creating the thirst. And the thirst come from being intellectually curious.
And every day, if you ask me, I spend most of my time really learning about new things that I don't know anything about. And that to me is what allows me to connect the dots, because every time I read something, that becomes a dot I keep it in my pocket until I see the second dot, I can connect the dot and say oh, now I can solve this problem. And that to me is the key, is to just keep collecting dots, until you find the missing dot, and you know how to solve the problem.

Eric Sue: So I find it hard to believe that you're only reading two hours. You're reading way more than that during the day, right? I feel like most of you day is just reading, learning, listening, watching, right?

Naveen Jain: That is in fact correct. What I was thinking, talking about the two hours in the morning simply going through my research articles in my Twitter feed.

Eric Sue: Got it. Okay. Perfect. Just a couple more questions here wrapping up. What's one must-read book that you recommend to everyone. I know you read a ton. So just, first one that comes to mind.

Naveen Jain: Honestly, that really depends on each subject. For example, on the healthcare side on the microbiome, I really love the book called, "Disease Delusion" by Jeff Bland and "The Human Superorganism." I just love both of them. It gives you a whole holistic view of the body. If you want to read the neuroscience book, I mean I love "Human Brain." And there are several books, but I think the book that I really, really enjoy was, "The Brain That Changes Itself." It's all about neuroplasticity, you'd really love that book. Then the great book that Ray Kurzweil wrote, "How to Create a Mind" really tells you about how human brain works. I can go on, I mean I love the book on epigenetics, a book called "Epigenetic Revolution" by Sarah Carey. So I mean anyway, each subject I can tell you the books that I just absolutely, thoroughly enjoy reading. Some of the books are just more on the general purpose things. I love Peter Diamindis' book called "Abundance." I absolutely loved it. There's a book that Clayton Christenson wrote "How Will You Measure Your Life?" Really loved it, right? Obviously you can't go wrong reading anything that Tony Robbins podcast, or other people that're just very, very inspiring to me.

Eric Sue: Here's a question that just popped up in my head. I mean, what's the difference, right? How do billionaires think differently versus millionaires?

Naveen Jain: I mean I think the difference really is the focus on big problems. They don't focus on simply making money. Making money is a by-product. So think of it, think of it itself, like making money is like having an orgasm. If you focus on it, you're never gonna get it. If you enjoy the process, you're gonna get it. So think of never want to start something to make money, but you wanna start something that you enjoy. And the process at the end, you really get what you want.

Eric Sue: Love it. Okay. Final question from my end: what's one new tool that you've added in the last year that's added a lot of value? Like Evernote.

Naveen Jain: The tool that I really enjoyed really is able to create the newsfeeds from my Twitter for very specific needs. So I have my Twitter feeds in the newsfeed of very specific things. So I don't have one single Twitter feed, I really create this grouped feed for my different things. And I'm able to actually go and really focus on what I'm trying to learn, and not be distracted by anything else.

Eric Sue: Love it. Well, Naveen, this has been fantastic. What's the best way for people to find you online?

Naveen Jain: I am actually online. You can find me on Facebook, you can find me on Twitter, you can find me on LinkedIn, and you can always send me email [email protected]

Eric Sue: Alright, Naveen, thanks so much for doing this.

Naveen Jain: Thank you, Eric, really look forward to it.

Eric Sue: Thanks for listening to this episode of Growth Everywhere. If you loved what you heard, be sure to head back to for today's show notes, and a ton of additional resources. But before you go, hit the subscribe button to avoid missing out on next week's value-packed interview. Enjoy the rest of your week, and remember to take action, and continue growing.